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Birch
09-15-2010, 12:32 PM
I was just kinda curious of what everyone thought about Nehtali as of right now?
Iv'e been toying around with a deck and honestly i've been plesantly surprised on the win percentage i have with the deck. I have more wins then loses. Im kinda skeptical on how it could actually do in a tournament. Whats everyones experience with her? good news bad news?

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 01:06 PM
I recently got first at my local tourney with her, I think she's absolutely fantastic. Her second ability is dumb-good, as for her first ability I have yet to use it. I don't see her being played off of water or evil until next set, but her+chaos= win. I can post up my deck list later if you are interested.

Birch
09-15-2010, 01:10 PM
I recently got first at my local tourney with her, I think she's absolutely fantastic. Her second ability is dumb-good, as for her first ability I have yet to use it. I don't see her being played off of water or evil until next set, but her+chaos= win. I can post up my deck list later if you are interested.

Yeah that'd be cool. Im running her off of chaos right now too, it'll be interesting to see the diffrences

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 01:16 PM
I'll post it up later as I am currently in school. Do you mind posting yours up as well? I too would like to see the differences.

Nubian God
09-15-2010, 01:42 PM
With my current build, I have only lost two single games. The biggest hurdle I see is somebody coming around with an Astaroth build. I've been able to power through my friend's Taki build that had over half of my staging area blanked, so I'm less apprehensive going against a Rashotep build. I'd be curious to see how it'll hold up against my friend's Bryan Fury build and any other straight aggro.

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 01:46 PM
Mine is pretty aggro. I have been able to play down 4 foundations turn 1 and turn 2 just drop like 4-5 attacks for the win.

Nubian God
09-15-2010, 01:53 PM
Most definitely. With my experience from previous games, Nehtali is definitely a Turn 1/Turn 2 character. Of course it's my luck that my attacks have habits of evading my hand every other game... =S

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 02:02 PM
Do you have the cheapo Michima Family Bloodline and Jin/Kazuya combo in your deck? Because that's what really helps me win.

Tagrineth
09-15-2010, 02:10 PM
She's neat, but she's definitely a little squishy and prone to dying horribly if she fails to win in those first turns.

Bloodrunstrue
09-15-2010, 02:29 PM
She's neat, but she's definitely a little squishy and prone to dying horribly if she fails to win in those first turns.

Yes because being a 7/21 who can negate Combos, Throws, Multiple etc. and is ENCOURAGED to run block cards is totally squishy :/.

She's going to be ridiculous when Horizon hits and she just makes COTTA even more ridiculous, although I persoanlly just like the fact that she's a 7/21 who can survive and extent almost on demand.


Hate to be doom and gloom but I predict a power jump in the next set.
GIVE ME SPOILERS!

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 02:56 PM
Yes because being a 7/21 who can negate Combos, Throws, Multiple etc. and is ENCOURAGED to run block cards is totally squishy :/.

She's going to be ridiculous when Horizon hits and she just makes COTTA even more ridiculous, although I persoanlly just like the fact that she's a 7/21 who can survive and extent almost on demand.


Hate to be doom and gloom but I predict a power jump in the next set.
GIVE ME SPOILERS!

She can't negate combos or throws. LRN2READ.

"R Commit 1 foundation and discard a block card: After your opponent plays an attack, choose 1 keyword ability on that attack. That ability may not be played during this attack's enhance step."

She only negates stun and multiple.

SMazzurco
09-15-2010, 03:04 PM
She can't negate combos or throws. LRN2READ.

"R Commit 1 foundation and discard a block card: After your opponent plays an attack, choose 1 keyword ability on that attack. That ability may not be played during this attack's enhance step."

She only negates stun and multiple.

and breaker

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 03:09 PM
and breaker
How can it stop breaker? Her ability can only be played after they play an attack. Can no one read?

Also my decklist is here. http://forums.jascogames.com/forums/showthread.php?1154-My-take-on-Nehtali.&p=13400#post13400

GrandmasterAmon
09-15-2010, 03:12 PM
What...is Powerful the red headed step child of keywords or something? Poor Powerful...

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 03:19 PM
What...is Powerful the red headed step child of keywords or something? Poor Powerful...
Alright, that one is legit and totally forgot about it. But in all fairness are there even any powerful card in standard right now? If so, I'm drawing a blank.

Tagrineth
09-15-2010, 03:25 PM
How can it stop breaker? Her ability can only be played after they play an attack. Can no one read?

FYI if you block with an attack you've still just played an attack. Way to be a :):):):):):)bag and be wrong about it... >_>

But she still can't stop Breaker, because she says the ability can't be played during that attack's Enhance step. Breaker isn't played during any Enhance step.

The keyword abilities she can currently disable are Stun, Powerful, and Multiple. That's it.


Oh, and Hades Destroyer, Lao Xie's Grinning Death, and Shockwave Palm all have Powerful in Standard.

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 03:32 PM
FYI if you block with an attack you've still just played an attack. Way to be a douchebag and be wrong about it... >_>

But she still can't stop Breaker, because she says the ability can't be played during that attack's Enhance step. Breaker isn't played during any Enhance step.

The keyword abilities she can currently disable are Stun, Powerful, and Multiple. That's it.


Oh, and Hades Destroyer, Lao Xie's Grinning Death, and Shockwave Palm all have Powerful in Standard.

I wasn't wrong. She can't stop breaker. I just left out the enhance part, which I clearly quoted. If he can't read, it's not my fault. And Tag :):):):) off. If this post gets me banned for the 400th time I'm ok with that.

Bloodrunstrue
09-15-2010, 03:33 PM
I wasn't wrong. She can't stop breaker. I just left out the enhance part, which I clearly quoted. If he can't read, it's not my fault. And Tag :):):):) off. If this post gets me banned for the 400th time I'm ok with that.

I didnt know it couldnt stop Combos, but i'm not going to complain since this helps keep her in check :D

Tagrineth
09-15-2010, 03:34 PM
http://twoheadeddragon.com/ufs/SNK05/scans/092.jpg

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 03:39 PM
I'm not trolling, I created my account the other day and have been adding to conversations legitimately all day. If I was trolling I wouldn't be talking about the subject at hand and pointing out where people have made mistakes.

Tagrineth
09-15-2010, 03:42 PM
I'm not trolling, I created my account the other day and have been adding to conversations legitimately all day. If I was trolling I wouldn't be talking about the subject at hand and pointing out where people have made mistakes.

Yeah but when I pointed out you were wrong, instead of, I dunno, admitting you were wrong, you instead told me to :) off and backpedaled with tripe that doesn't even match up with what you'd previously said. To wit -


I wasn't wrong. She can't stop breaker. I just left out the enhance part, which I clearly quoted.

Your entire prior post on the subject:



and breakerHow can it stop breaker? Her ability can only be played after they play an attack. Can no one read?

Also my decklist is here. http://forums.jascogames.com/forums/showthread.php?1154-My-take-on-Nehtali.&p=13400#post13400

You didn't quote a damned thing about Enhances, so "clearly quoted" is "clearly backpedaling" and "clearly wrong". Your entire statement was that she can't stop breaker because she can "only be played after they play an attack", which is entirely incorrect reasoning. QED.

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 03:52 PM
Wow a typo must mean that I back pedaled to being wrong. I was right, you pointed out that I was right but had used the wrong wording to point it out. And I decided to make myself wrong. You're right, I'm trolling... myself obviously with that logic.

Tagrineth
09-15-2010, 03:59 PM
Or just trolling me for reactions, which, if you are, you've been successful so far. Either way, though, I've made my point.

Arch Duke Obvious
09-15-2010, 04:07 PM
Next person to circumvent the smiley face filter is going to get a fate far worst than banning. A post full of smiley faces!!!

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 04:09 PM
Or just trolling me for reactions, which, if you are, you've been successful so far. Either way, though, I've made my point.
I meant what you said, but didn't say it correctly. I made a mistake. The end. It's over. She can't negate breaker.

Birch
09-15-2010, 04:41 PM
Next person to circumvent the smiley face filter is going to get a fate far worst than banning. A post full of smiley faces!!!

Did anyone else think this was the funniest thing they've ever read? Thank you admin. And ill get to posting later tonight.

Birch
09-15-2010, 04:44 PM
No one has really given me there opinion on her as a competitive character. If we could get back on track. lol.

ARMed_PIrate
09-15-2010, 04:50 PM
I didnt know it couldnt stop Combos, but i'm not going to complain since this helps keep her in check :D

In case anyone wanted clarification:

"2.14.2.2 Combo
Combo: (X) - In order to play the Combo ability written in the
card text box, you must have cards with the required traits (noted in the
parentheses) in the card pool immediately preceding this card in the listed order.
Any references given to zones in the requirements refer to attack zones.
2.14.2.2.1 The Combo keyword is a continous ability."

In other words, Combo is continuous, not played, so it can't be negated by Nehtali.
The "Combo ability written in the card text box" (could be better-worded) is the played ability in the text box preceded by the word Combo. It is not a keyword ability; it is just an ability that becomes "unlocked" by the continuous Combo ability if the required conditions have been met. So Nehtali can't negate that either.

So as Tag said, you gots 3 keyword abilities that are normally played during the Enhance step: Powerful, Multiple, Stun. All the other keyword abilities are either not played during the Enhance step, or continuous abilities (not played at all).

Hatman
09-15-2010, 05:05 PM
Guys, she uses her hand as a resource to fuel her abilities.

She has few card draw options in her symbols, and even her 7 HS can't fuel them forever.

I dunno, just throwing that out there.

EscarcegaGuy
09-15-2010, 05:16 PM
Guys, she uses her hand as a resource to fuel her abilities.

She has few card draw options in her symbols, and even her 7 HS can't fuel them forever.

I dunno, just throwing that out there.

I've never had the problem of running out of cards, and that's with me using Lion Slayer, Merciless fighter, and her ability.

Link
09-15-2010, 05:26 PM
Ive been playing around with her since Gencon, the water one kinda sucks because of the lack of draw, but the Chaos version does have enough if you run characters. Between Mishima Family Bloodline, Body Of Souls,and Ancient Fighting Style you can draw plenty, espectially with some key discard you run *cough* Hunt is on *cough*.

I dont see how she is really good early game though. Ive always foundher to be best mid to late game once you have a setup myself.

Do I think she is tourney viable? hell yes. Most of the ways to kill right now are stun, and multiple.

Birch
09-15-2010, 05:42 PM
Ive been playing around with her since Gencon, the water one kinda sucks because of the lack of draw, but the Chaos version does have enough if you run characters. Between Mishima Family Bloodline, Body Of Souls,and Ancient Fighting Style you can draw plenty, espectially with some key discard you run *cough* Hunt is on *cough*.

I dont see how she is really good early game though. Ive always foundher to be best mid to late game once you have a setup myself.

Do I think she is tourney viable? hell yes. Most of the ways to kill right now are stun, and multiple.

Agreed. She can stop alot of kills with her ability. I believe that could be effective in tournament play.

Da_ghetto_gamer
09-15-2010, 09:25 PM
I want Smiley Faces in my post!!! (:

Back on topic though....Ive been waiting for the water AtoP to become legal so i can run her off of water, play 2 attacks then use her check boosting to play Rising Typhoon and multiply....water just needs a little something to push it into being playable before i can reliably make a deck around it

I think though if she could negate any keywords then she would be a little busted but as of right now im going to say shes decent at best

ATLDrew
09-15-2010, 11:09 PM
@Escarcega- Hey dude Ive heard the deck is pretty solid. Maybe when i dont have to close every weekend I can actually play against it. What attack lineup are you running? The infinite Powerful with Curse of the Ancient Mariner or just a lot of good Chaos attacks with the Algol spread and such?

EscarcegaGuy
09-16-2010, 04:52 PM
@Escarcega- Hey dude Ive heard the deck is pretty solid. Maybe when i dont have to close every weekend I can actually play against it. What attack lineup are you running? The infinite Powerful with Curse of the Ancient Mariner or just a lot of good Chaos attacks with the Algol spread and such?
I have my deck posted up in the deck building section. But yeah it's a chaos beatdown. I wasn't smart enough to think of running her with evil attacks.

ATLDrew
09-17-2010, 12:25 AM
I have my deck posted up in the deck building section. But yeah it's a chaos beatdown. I wasn't smart enough to think of running her with evil attacks.

Seeing as how Evil is crap right now, maybe you were smart in NOT thinking about adding them.

Hatman
09-17-2010, 10:03 AM
Seeing as how Evil is crap right now, maybe you were smart in NOT thinking about adding them.

It's less crap than Water, I can tell you that much.

Birch
09-17-2010, 05:52 PM
It's less crap than Water, I can tell you that much.

yeah your right evil attacks are absolutely :):):):)..... oh wait.

LuchaHeroAl
09-17-2010, 11:12 PM
yeah your right evil attacks are absolutely :):):):)..... oh wait.

Look at evil foundations. They make me cry.

Hatman
09-18-2010, 12:30 AM
Look at evil foundations. They make me cry.

They're not so bad... somewhat. I'd love some sort of cohesion between what they do, but yeah.

Birch
09-18-2010, 12:54 AM
They're not so bad... somewhat. I'd love some sort of cohesion between what they do, but yeah.

yeah they have like no synergy, a few pretty brutal attacks though, and evil bryan fury actually works which is odd...

Hatman
09-18-2010, 01:19 PM
yeah they have like no synergy, a few pretty brutal attacks though, and evil bryan fury actually works which is odd...

With Divine Harvester, my stupid ass Jon Herr build off Evil may actually work.

SMazzurco
09-18-2010, 01:24 PM
With Divine Harvester, my stupid ass Jon Herr build off Evil may actually work.

your only problem was momentum gen?

I thought Herr (especially off evil) had a lot more than that going against him right now

Hatman
09-18-2010, 01:43 PM
your only problem was momentum gen?

I thought Herr (especially off evil) had a lot more than that going against him right now
Generally, I could melt faces pretty easily, but I failed to finish my opponent's off. Divine Harvester's CChax may help me defend myself better.