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Thread: Incorrect ruling given at Poughkeepsie PTC leads to an interesting revelation

  1. #1
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    Incorrect ruling given at Poughkeepsie PTC leads to an interesting revelation

    So, myself, and several others have always played with the general convention that attacks pending in the attack queue receive continuous bonuses and penalties when they start resolving.

    The moment in question was when Kevin's Vega was in Desperation and had a Multiple attack played against him - if he leaves desperation after the Multiple copy is generated, does the Multiple copy get the -1 speed or not?

    The answer I gave at the time was no, it does not, but that was actually wrong!

    Attacks pending in the attack queue will receive continuous bonuses immediately upon being eligible for them.

    So in Kevin's case, the multiple copy has already received the -1 speed, immediately upon being created, and will not lose the -1 speed!

    Interesting ramifications: If you're against a Desperation Vega and he drops a Multiple attack while a Kanzuki Dojo is in play, you have to respond with Kanzuki Dojo to the speed bonuses you want to respond to right away. You cannot wait until you start resolving the multiple copies.

    Similarly, Survivalist must respond to such continuous bonuses given to Multiple copies immediately upon creation. So if you're running Survivalist against a Slaughterhouse Rainflush deck, the moment that Rainflush multiple copy is added to the pool, it will get the +2 damage from Slaughterhouse and thus trigger Survivalist during the resolution of the originating attack.

    Kinda neat! I honestly never thought about it this way and I'm not sure why. This feels like yet another UFS slap-on-the-forehead type realisation similar to, say, realising that multiple copies of multiple copies resulted in 0 speed 0 damage broken attacks.

    I felt like it would be a good idea to bring this up before the community at large, because from my limited discussion with players at the Poughkeepsie PTC, while there were many people that immediately understood the ramifications of this ruling, few seemed to already be aware of it / play that way, and many people seemed surprised to hear that the rules work this way and had, similar to myself, simply stuck to the convention of waiting for a pending attack to begin resolving to apply bonuses and penalties.
    hay guise, im ofishul

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  2. #2
    Senior Member wafflecopter's Avatar
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    realising that multiple copies of multiple copies resulted in 0 speed 0 damage broken attacks.
    FWIW, they're now mid zone instead of "no zone"

    We could really use flowcharts for how Response windows open and close during common scenarios. Who knows someone with some graphic design experience to make them good?
    http://i.imgur.com/nxMBqb4.gifv

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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by wafflecopter View Post
    FWIW, they're now mid zone instead of "no zone"
    Yeah lol well that's the result of Multiplying a facedown attack, not a multiple copy - which no longer works at all!

    I'm talking more about the Aha! moment back in like the 3 point meta when we realised that decks like Starter Ukyo infinite combo did not work at all.
    hay guise, im ofishul

    Oldschool Deck articles! I II III IV V

  4. #4
    Senior Member wafflecopter's Avatar
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    Oh I misread what you wrote -- specifically I skipped to "0spd 0dmg broken attack" and filled in "printed stats of a multiple copy", which until fairly recently did matter. (Sean actually pulled the "printed zone" trick on someone in tournament, I guess)

    And it's just "multiple-of-multiple" that doesn't work, right? I'm allowed to copy a Flying Spear with Ash2 and multiple it to get a 0M0?
    http://i.imgur.com/nxMBqb4.gifv

    To edit a post, click Edit Post (brings up the Quick Edit thing over your post - ignore it), then click Edit Post again (this takes you to the detailed post page, where your edit can actually save)

    Living Game Rules document v03.txt, because maybe you want to search through it?

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